Comments on: She sells seashells by the Seaside http://blog.amber.org/2005/11/23/she-sells-seashells-by-the-seaside/ Thoughts of a minor lunatic Wed, 21 Oct 2009 01:55:36 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: petrilli http://blog.amber.org/2005/11/23/she-sells-seashells-by-the-seaside/comment-page-1/#comment-5293 petrilli Sun, 05 Feb 2006 04:42:24 +0000 http://blog.amber.org/?p=1845#comment-5293 Actually modern relational databases aren't very modern, or very powerful. They're really quite antiquated and I'd much prefer "modern object databases," which in some ways is what a Smalltalk image is. The question of where to store data is a complex question, and largely depends on the issues of what you are storing and the read/write/update model that is used. Many applications I work on have strange profiles for data usage. Either they are exceptionally high update, which kills "modern relational databases" dead, or have scary-high (1000:1) write to read ratios, with updates verbotten, that also kill "modern relational database." Instead, I've often had to design custom data stores. The "flexible query system" many people think of, etc., is great when you are designing a general purpose -- one size fits all, looks good on nobody -- solution, but in many situations, I'm dealing with very unusual data mining strategies and again, query optimization often requires hand-tuning to perform at the level of performance needed. I realize I don't work in the normal rectangular accounting world, but then neither do a lot of people. They just try and use it as a box to constrain their solutions. Actually modern relational databases aren’t very modern, or very powerful. They’re really quite antiquated and I’d much prefer “modern object databases,” which in some ways is what a Smalltalk image is. The question of where to store data is a complex question, and largely depends on the issues of what you are storing and the read/write/update model that is used.

Many applications I work on have strange profiles for data usage. Either they are exceptionally high update, which kills “modern relational databases” dead, or have scary-high (1000:1) write to read ratios, with updates verbotten, that also kill “modern relational database.” Instead, I’ve often had to design custom data stores.

The “flexible query system” many people think of, etc., is great when you are designing a general purpose—one size fits all, looks good on nobody—solution, but in many situations, I’m dealing with very unusual data mining strategies and again, query optimization often requires hand-tuning to perform at the level of performance needed.

I realize I don’t work in the normal rectangular accounting world, but then neither do a lot of people. They just try and use it as a box to constrain their solutions.

]]> By: joe http://blog.amber.org/2005/11/23/she-sells-seashells-by-the-seaside/comment-page-1/#comment-5292 joe Sun, 05 Feb 2006 04:06:37 +0000 http://blog.amber.org/?p=1845#comment-5292 "just storing the objects in the Smalltalk image"...no offense, but this really makes me shudder. Don't know anything about your app so maybe it was the perfect solution, but for anything really sizeable that can't afford to screw up, you really need all the fancy concurrency stuff that modern relational databases have. It'd be non-trivial to re-implement. Not to mention indexing, some kind of flexible query system, query optimization, robust transactional backup...the list goes on. “just storing the objects in the Smalltalk image”...no offense, but this really makes me shudder. Don’t know anything about your app so maybe it was the perfect solution, but for anything really sizeable that can’t afford to screw up, you really need all the fancy concurrency stuff that modern relational databases have. It’d be non-trivial to re-implement. Not to mention indexing, some kind of flexible query system, query optimization, robust transactional backup…the list goes on.

]]> By: Matt http://blog.amber.org/2005/11/23/she-sells-seashells-by-the-seaside/comment-page-1/#comment-5142 Matt Mon, 02 Jan 2006 04:32:02 +0000 http://blog.amber.org/?p=1845#comment-5142 I agree, Seaside makes you think about the web in a different way. I built an inventory management application with it in a period of less than 24 hours that works beautifully. And there is some complex logic, something that would have given me headaches in rails. As for database integration, since this was a new application I opted for just storing the objects in the Smalltalk image. A class level variable suited me just fine. I agree, Seaside makes you think about the web in a different way. I built an inventory management application with it in a period of less than 24 hours that works beautifully. And there is some complex logic, something that would have given me headaches in rails. As for database integration, since this was a new application I opted for just storing the objects in the Smalltalk image. A class level variable suited me just fine.

]]> By: Brendan Taylor http://blog.amber.org/2005/11/23/she-sells-seashells-by-the-seaside/comment-page-1/#comment-4685 Brendan Taylor Thu, 24 Nov 2005 19:21:30 +0000 http://blog.amber.org/?p=1845#comment-4685 If you're not already aware of it, Borges is a Ruby port of Seaside. And yeah, it's reeeaal nice. If you’re not already aware of it, Borges is a Ruby port of Seaside. And yeah, it’s reeeaal nice.

]]>